Episode Transcript
[00:00:05] Speaker A: Welcome to the Clear Impact Podcast, brought to you by PGTI University. Thanks for joining us today. My name is Sherry Connor and I am your host.
[00:00:17] Speaker B: Good afternoon. We are here on the Clear Impact podcast, and we are back in our leadership series with Brian Lingle for episode three in this little series, and this is around leadership and self deception. So welcome back, Brian.
[00:00:32] Speaker C: Good to be back. Thanks for having me.
[00:00:33] Speaker B: Yeah, thanks for taking the time to chat with us. Our last conversation just really was great. So I'm excited to hear what we're going to talk about today. So if you're just catching this, we are talking about this leadership development that you've been leading for the last year and a half here. And it's from the Arbinger Institute. And this is a series of three books. And so today we're talking about the second book, which is Leadership and Self Deception. And so in this book, they're talking about self deception being in the box. And so we touched on that a little bit. Can you just refresh us? What is that?
[00:01:10] Speaker C: Yeah, so when we think about this book, Leadership and Self Deception, this is kind of the book that we pretty much have been just flooding into our organization, right? This is the book that Lisa Jackson read, got to Jeff, then Jeff got with me, and this kind of started us on this journey. And so this is the book that we give to everybody before they have the class, they have a book they take with that from there to really kind of spread that, if you will, right? And so this really kind of opens us up to be alive to, okay, what's that look like? Right? When we think about being in the box, being self deceived kind of brings us alive to sort of the fact of, okay, how am I seeing that individual? And again, simplistically put as we think about this, how do I see people? If I keep it? Simplistic. If I say I see them as a person, that's what we're saying out of the box means, right? If I'm seeing them in the box, I'm seeing them as an object. They're a vehicle, an irrelevance, if you will. I'm not seeing them as a person, right? I'm only focused, if you will, when I'm in the box on myself, my desires, my needs, my wants, if you will, I'm not alive to those individuals, if you will, at all. Because what matters in that moment when I'm in the box is simply me. Now, when I'm out of the box, I really am seeing people as people, and then I'm seeing them in the same way I see myself. What matters to me in regards to my wants, my needs, my desires, what are they? And recognizing that those individuals also have once needs and desires, and how do I impact them? Do I impact them in a negative way or a positive way? Am I even alive to what those once needs or desires are? Do I even know what they are? Do I have any concept or clue as to what they are? But when I'm in the box, I am deceived because I'm only seeing things through whatever box I'm in, whatever that might be. And we talked a little bit jokingly on our last one about when I'm coming around the corner and see the trash can sitting out by the curb on trash day, right? Well, immediately my vehicle becomes the largest I deserve box that you can imagine. So there when I'm in that box, right, I'm viewing everything through the lens of I deserve. And I'm coloring my interaction through that lens. So now I'm in that justification process of why I deserve. And you go through it, right? Every one of us. I work hard.
[00:03:17] Speaker B: I left the house at 06:00 a.m.. And yeah, somebody else should have taken care of that by now. And why didn't they?
[00:03:22] Speaker C: They're not working that hard. They had plenty of time. They're like 96ft away. I've measured it. It's not that hard.
[00:03:28] Speaker B: They're 30 years younger than me. They could have easily done it.
[00:03:31] Speaker C: Exactly, right. So I'm in that process now. All of that is happening up here in the gray matter. As I'm getting closer to the house, I'm building that justification, right? I'm strengthening the walls of the box. And then when I go in and I see that face, that non trash can carrying face, right. I have now fortified my walls in that box and greatly colored the interaction that I'm going to have with that individual. Right? So that's really kind of what we're talking about when we think about this in the box, sort of, if you will, and how we operate in those boxes, by the way. We all have them. Everyone does. And one of the things that I found beautiful about the Arbinger training that they talk about some boxes you just carry around with you could be I deserve. It, could be need to be seen as but you carry it with you, meaning that you're preconditioned through whatever you've created in this self deception in that regard, that you're going to enter into a space with that box and you're just simply there. And then you're really almost preloaded to simply jump in and operate from that box, if you will. And again, as you do that over and over again, that becomes the prescribed lens in which you view people through. So your interactions are going to be greatly colored by the fact that you're operating in an I deserve box or need to be seen as box, right?
[00:04:44] Speaker B: Because it's all perception.
[00:04:46] Speaker C: And so as we kind of do that habitualizing, that that becomes what we do. And so we do a big series. There's a section in the training where it gives you sort of scenarios. And we start off with everyone's in the box and we'll go through some scenarios in the classroom. We'll have them up on the walls. We call it the Four Walls exercise. And we'll just throw some stuff out to the group and we'll say, okay, so you are in a meeting and you make what you think is a really great point and no one says anything. And so we'll have up I deserve need to be seen as less than worse than kind of thing. And we ask where do you go? Right? And so they'll move to a certain area and we'll just sort of unpack it a little bit. Well, why are you going there? What's that look like? Because no one recognized it. And my ideas are incredible and they need to be validated. So it's really getting to the heart of we operate that way, we think that way and then we respond a certain way. So really at the heart of it, that's really what it is when you're in the box.
[00:05:37] Speaker B: So we land there, we carry them around. It's kind of a default or underlying mindset. And so how do we get out of the box?
[00:05:47] Speaker C: Yeah, and we've touched on this and I think it's just being alive to the fact that there even is a box that exists.
[00:05:53] Speaker B: So awareness, awareness.
[00:05:54] Speaker C: A lot of the training when we go through this, this is not like rocket science stuff. When we're going through this, there's a lot of AHA moments where individuals like, yeah, I do do that. That's right. So a lot of it is just simply okay, now it's putting like vernacular to it, right. The verbiage to this sort of getting a hold of what this looks like and we think about the awareness of sort of in the box is just being alive to, okay, well, what do I got to do to get out of the box? What's that got to look like? And with that comes, I think, a pause of just being willing to stop in that moment to arrest the thinking patterns and to recognize that I'm not seeing this person as a person. I'm seeing them as an object, a vehicle or an irrelevance right. An inconvenience, whatever it would be. And then just being alive to that very factor and sort of pausing that and stopping that and saying, okay, how do I get out of the box toward this individual? Right? How am I going to get curious with them, find out what happened today in their day, what took place, what went on, what was their day like at work? What did they experientially go through? Not even addressing the issue of the trash cans, right?
[00:06:55] Speaker B: So people before the trash, people before.
[00:06:57] Speaker C: Right, we'll get to the trash cans. But how do I make sure that first and foremost, I'm curious. I want to understand what happened in their day, what's taking place, and really sort of just be aware of their wants, their needs, their desires. Going back to what we talked about and just being alive, to the fact that I'm not going in the box. I'm going to stay with this and figure out what's going on and what's happening with that. Right? And arbitrary's got a ton of tools that really help us go through that when we think we're trying to sort of that meet to learn I talked about, it's really a good tool to sort of just figure out, okay, what don't I know? How can I help? What's that look like and whatnot? So there's a lot of great stuff there for that.
[00:07:36] Speaker A: Be sure to tune in for upcoming episodes to help you understand the fenestration industry, what you need to know when buying windows and doors and other related topics. You can find out more about us@pgtioniversity.com. You can also find us on Facebook and LinkedIn.
[00:07:53] Speaker B: Well, and that kind of goes along with something that we've been practicing in my household, which is assume positive intent.
[00:07:59] Speaker C: Right? Yeah. Just think how that reframes how you.
[00:08:01] Speaker B: Think of somebody like, was I trying to hurt your feelings when I said that? Or was I just not really paying attention to the fact that you've had a hard day or whatever.
[00:08:11] Speaker C: That's an awesome one. Yeah, I love that one.
[00:08:13] Speaker B: Assume positive intent.
[00:08:14] Speaker C: Yeah. Because again, a lot of this too, like we talked, it's not this Pollyannash sort of gets going to all hold hands and sing Kumbaya kind of, right? Because we have times when we are nasty towards one another. We don't treat each other the way that we should. I'm not unveiling some incredible truth here when we're honest about it. But why is that? What's going on there in that individual, right? And what's taking place? And if I'm in the box towards that person, I'm not going to navigate that well. But if I could be outward and just really try to get to the heart of what's going on with an individual, that's huge, I think, in regards to being able to navigate that space in a far more safe way and also coming out with a more harmonious result. And to me, there's tremendous value in doing that. Not easy because we got our emotions, we've got experiences, right? We've got history, we've got all those different things with that individual. But this kind of stuff, I think, can be, I can remember in this training individuals that became alive to the fact that they had been in a we call it collusion, where it's this sort of cycle of behavior that you behave a certain way which drives a certain result, which gets a certain behavior which has you behave a certain way.
It's this circular sort of, if you will, vortex of destruction. I can remember in training individuals that feel like they were in these for 20 some years with spouses where they had been in this sort of colluded environment. I can tell you for a fact, every class that I've led and taught, every one of them within our organization, they all felt they were in collusions in the organization with another area, another team, right. Where they just came alive to the fact of like, oh my gosh, I am in the box and I'm in a collusion. So when you think about the impact of organizations, the wasted money, time, energy, and sort of being inward towards somebody, instead of addressing, okay, how do we get out of this?
[00:10:03] Speaker B: Yeah. How can we work together to solve this common problem instead of pointing fingers at each other or if you would just do your part, then I could do my part. But because you're not doing your part now, I'm stuck and now I look bad.
[00:10:15] Speaker C: And so I'm going to act a certain way towards you. Every time I see you, I'm in that box towards you. And that's that collusion. That is powerful.
[00:10:22] Speaker B: So dysfunctional.
[00:10:23] Speaker C: Oh yeah.
[00:10:24] Speaker B: They're pervasive well because we're people.
[00:10:26] Speaker C: We are, yeah, very much so.
[00:10:27] Speaker B: So this applies to organizations in the way that we interact across teams and within teams upward and downward. So that has to be super challenging as leaders, because leaders have a higher level of responsibility, they have more that they're accountable for. And as leaders, it's not you, it's your team. So you have to be able to relate well to your team or they're not going to perform. And then you're going to be looking for a new job. So you've got to be able to navigate these spaces in a positive way to get the most out of people. And not because you want to get the most out of people, but because you want to be a good leader and you've been entrusted to lead that team.
[00:11:05] Speaker C: Exactly. I mean, at the end of the day, I believe this applied across an organization ultimately impacts the bottom line because you're going to really drive results, because you're making an investment in people, you're building relationships. Those people know that they have worth, that they matter, they're cared for. Right. They have value that brings with it incredible amounts of loyalty and tenure with team members. Because again, if you're in that kind of environment, you don't necessarily want to go somewhere else.
[00:11:31] Speaker B: Oh no.
[00:11:32] Speaker C: When you know you have a leader that cares about you and you're not necessarily looking to sort of go someplace else because you're not sure what that water is going to be like, but you know where you're at now. But if we can do that within teams and then across teams in an organization, the benefits that can bring from a collaboration standpoint is huge. And so like we do every Monday, we have Mindset Mondays, which is a 30 minutes program that I run where we meet and we discuss outward minds. It's 30 minutes Monday, 30 minutes all for the week. And we create a deck. So we start the week off out of the box, and we meet together, and there's almost 200 of us on the call, and they don't all show up, but it's available to them, right? We go over the content that we've covered. We go over mindset moments. We create Mindset Moments where it's like, okay, when did you anybody have any moments this week where they're like, oh my gosh, I'm in the box right now, or I'm behaving in a certain way? We launch a tool. We use a tool from the toolbox from the Arbinger portal because every one of our folks gets access to that. We bring that forward, and we talk about in that meeting, we say to everyone that's there you are, the champions of this organization. You're the bannerman carrying the outward Mindset flag through the organization. It starts with us because we started at the very top, and we worked this the whole way down, and it's got to be there because if it's not being done there, don't expect me to live it out down here. So it's getting them to understand you have to carry this banner. You have to be champion to this, because if you don't, there's no possible way this is going to carry the day. It's going to have no life. Because again, why should I? And the powerful part about this, and I'll just share this. When I was going through my training, we were doing some training, and my first class that I did was a virtual course. And we would break out into these groups and breakout groups, and we'd go and have these discussions. And I had a group of individuals from I won't name where they were from, but they would come into these breakouts, and it was like they weren't even ready. They weren't even remotely even prepared for what we were getting ready to discuss. They just were like, I'm like, what are they doing? So finally, the third one of these, I was kind of like, look, I got to ask a question, guy. We're coming together, and it feels like you're not even paying attention to what you're supposed to bring into this sort of breakout group. And they're like, look, man, do I think this is good stuff? Yeah, I do. I said. But here's the issue. My leaders don't. So it doesn't matter that'll stay with me because they were there, because they were volunteered to be there, but they were not engaged at all because they felt there was no reason to go on through this. It was almost like this was just kind of like a punitive sort of action that was placed upon them. And it didn't matter, really, at the end of the day, because their leaders, they're not going to buy into it. So the Mindset Monday is really to sort of say, listen, this won't work. I don't care how many books you get out if you're not going to live it out. It's not going to matter. So I think the impact of this organizationally can be unbelievable. And Arbiter has seen that. I mean, they've seen that at some of the organizations they work with. But it's definitely something that you have to champion. You've got to carry the banner of it because otherwise it'll get forgotten.
[00:14:23] Speaker B: That's powerful stuff. Yeah, I'm excited. Yeah, maybe I'll get in that. Maybe it won't be 200. Maybe it'll be like, the top 2500, and I'll make that cut. I don't know.
[00:14:32] Speaker C: Well, that's the hope. I mean, that's really we're meeting, actually, November.
[00:14:35] Speaker B: Okay.
[00:14:36] Speaker C: We're meeting. I'm excited for 2024. Got my 2024 giant wall calendar up. I'm ready to map out Arbinger and 21 laws. And all the stuff that we do that to me is, like, for myself, it's down to that level, like, to that team leader level where they touch so many people every single day. Because again, I see how powerful this is and on the impact of a person's life and how you interact with someone, and when you're treated as if you have worth and that you matter and you're valued. Right. That gets me excited. I mean, to think about being part of an organization that drives that to where this experience is going to be one that's incredibly positive for you, because we care about you and we want you to see you to be the best you can be. Huge.
[00:15:14] Speaker B: Yeah. And so for our dealers, like, for our dealer audience, these are smaller organizations where their impact is even more profound because they have more interaction day to day with their teams, with their staff. They're not spread amongst 5500. Maybe they're spread across five or 25. And so that influence is even greater because you have that closeness, that proximity factor, which, if I see Jeff once a month passing in the hallway, that's probably more than most, honestly. And so if you're a small business owner and you have a smaller team, even more powerful for them.
[00:15:48] Speaker C: Very much so.
[00:15:49] Speaker B: All right, well, we're going to wrap this up and then we'll come back and visit book Three in a bit.
[00:15:53] Speaker C: All right, sounds good.
[00:15:54] Speaker B: Thanks. Thanks, Brian.
[00:15:55] Speaker C: Bye.
[00:15:56] Speaker A: PGTI University is the customer education team for an entire family of brands. We began with the original Easy Breeze Porch enclosure line, then became PGT, america's leading brand of impact resistant windows and doors. We then added CGI. CGIC Windor Western Window Systems, new South Windows, Echo Windows and Doors, Anlin Windows and Doors. And our latest acquisition, Martin Garage Doors. We create products built to withstand major storms, keeping people safe, secure and prepared. Our exceptional brands give you the protection you need without compromising design or functionality. PGTI University is here to educate you, our listener, so that you can be a more informed consumer of window indoor products.
Sam.
